Relevant to this conversation: https://cynicallittlegames.wordpress.com/2015/05/27/thoughts-on-seduction-in-pvp/ (please don’t tag the author; he asked not to join this conversation today.)

Seduction and manipulation mechanics, no matter how well-intentioned, remove player agency. It’s better to err on the side of relying on player acting ability than a die roll, even if that means the poorer actor loses. Honestly, though– how often is someone a really persuasive actor, but a bad improv’er (I’m making a leap here and assuming a good improv person will say yes to a clumsy manipulation attempt if it makes a better story)? I know it happens, but perhaps it happens less often than we realize.

I definitely think there’s a difference between “play to win” and “play to be interesting” styles of play (I won’t say players, because the same player can be either).